Interesting Question re: Trading Policy

[Wade]

Ok, so the NC trading policy states that at no time can we trade video recordings of their performances. This is quite undertsandable, since at no time do they allow unauthorized video recordings of their performances in the first place. Thus, since you are not allowed to video a show, you are prohibited from trading a video that was not allowed in the first place.

However, what about trading/b&p'ing copies of the Austin City Limits performance? Clearly this was an authorized videotape/broadcast of a live performance (as opposed to an UNauthorized bootleg video) on public television.

Thoughts?

[matt the fiddler]

if you want the fine print.....

from the pbs website

Are video tapes, CDs or audio cassettes available for ACL?
Unfortunately, due to agreements with the Public Broadcasting Service (PBS) and the American Federation of Musicians, KLRU (producer of Austin City Limits) cannot release tapes of most of the performances on the series.
There are a few exceptions listed below. All of these videos, DVDs and others are available when you become a member of KLRU.

based off of that, and the fact that the copyright of the program is held by pbs- you would i tihnk technically have to follow nickel creek and pbs's rules on copying and or fair use.. copying video tapes or recording tv in general has a very specific set of guidelines, most uses allowed are for review, by a small part of the piece, or the whole thing for education use, [but must be destroyed by a certian date after recording...] technicall anyoen who records off of tv coudl be found to be breaking some copyright law------

but the fair use clause is a loop hole- not sure if applies to tv broadcasts.... or trading..... i am musician, not a lawyer.... and generally don't like to get caught up into the fine print, so i am not the one to give a yes or no answer to that question... because it is a pretty complex question [thanks to modern law]

mabye chip has some insight....

matt

[Chip]

Hmmmm.

Wade brings up an interesting point, one that I was thinking about in light of several recent posts asking for the ACL show.

If we're talking in technical, legal terms, copying of shows broadcast on TV is probably not OK -- there is no compulsory licensing for sync performance (the performance of music on television) as there is for audio-only performances -- and there are a bazillion unions associated with televison production who all have their hand out. And fair use doesn't really extend to giving your friend a copy of the intellectual property in question.

BUT... I've had several lengthy conversations with John Peets, NC's management, on the issue of taping (Matt and I drafted the original policy and I edited the final version based on John's changes and additions) and while I don't in any way speak for NC or it's management, I can infer some sense of the intent that John was trying to achieve in creating the policy, based on our conversations.

No one wants to upset the record company, the publishing company, or any of the others who control NC's intellectual property, but with a program such as ACL that's been broadcast all over, it could easily have been taped for personal use by many people.

As such, I am guessing that no one would object strenuously if there were a few individuals doing B&P for the ACL shows. But I would also suggest that we keep it low key and not flood the taping boards with requests for trades of TV performances.

Disclaimer: This is NOT an official statement, and I have no authority to speak for the band or anyone else on this subject, this is just my opinion. Your mileage may vary.

[Goose_17]

Your mileage may vary.

LOL..kinda like..Objects in mirror appear closer than they actually are.

[Wade]

[Matt the Fiddler says] if you want the fine print..... {and} i am musician, not a lawyer

[To which I reply] i am a lawyer, and not a musician.

I appreciate Chip's insight into the intent behind the Nickel Creek taping policy. Oftentimes, intent and result do not coincide due to the simple fact that its difficult to cover every scenario with a blanket policy. Given the Admins background into helping develop and foster this policy, I think I can better understand where the proverbial line in the sand is drawn.

Thanks Chip, thanks Matt, and thanks Nickel Creek.

[Mostlydead]

Wade,
Hey I've tried to email you via the mailing address you posted on your profile but you don't reply. could you post the real one or whatever on here? or send me a mail or private message. I'm wanting to trade with you.

Sam

[Chip]

Originally posted by Wade
Oftentimes, intent and result do not coincide due to the simple fact that its difficult to cover every scenario with a blanket policy.

Yup, that's *exactly* it. Striking a balance between something that was reasonable enough to allow the fans to share music, while not trampling too much on the rights of the record companies and publishers... and at the same time, doing so without making the policy overly long and complex was what John indicated he was aiming for... and so far, it seems to be serving pretty well.

With luck, people will continue to abide by the band's wishes, and we'll be able to tape, trade and share NC's live performances for a long time to come :)